Upgrade to Phaserunner V3

[Altema]

I had a situation where a sharp edge of my battery mounting plate decided to take advantage of the wires pressed against it. The result was a short which only made itself known when I plugged a cable into the display USB port, sending 52 volts back through the controller the wrong way. Sparks were made, but all the safeties worked, and the only damage was the controller itself losing it's mind. I carved out the wiring passage to make it bigger, removed all the edges, repaired the wiring, and added multiple layers of tough insulation. I installed a 35 amp controller replacement, but have a 100 amp Phaserunner controller on the way.

The 35 amp will remain on the bike for a while as I build out the wiring harness for the Phaserunner. This controller does not have inputs for brakes or pedal assist, as those go through the Cycle Analyst display. It's quite a bit different, and I want to sort everything out before installing it on the bike. The power will be turned down to the same levels I have now, or even a bit less. This will solve my noise and glitch problems with the 35 amp controller, but will also enable full computer programming and field weakening.

[Altema]

The Phaserunner arrived, but not the adapter cable for hooking up the display! Fortunately, the Phaserunner does not NEED a display to work as a basic throttle-only controller. So, I built a wiring harness for the motor phase wires and hall sensor lines, made the connector for power, and a new line for the throttle. This way, I was able to install the new controller, set it up, and do testing. There were several issues, like the throttle wiring colors not even being close, weak off the line acceleration, and a few other configuration nuances, but I was able to resolve those.

The Phaserunner is not a typical sine wave or trapezoidal wave controller, and must be configured and "tuned" for each specific motor. Even after making the necessary wiring connectors and running the autotune program (which only sets a few parameters), there was several hours spent making adjustments and getting the throttle working. I finished my test rides at 2am, then did further adjustments the next day. How is it? Silent and buttery smooth. I powered the bike past my wife in the living room of our house, and she could not even hear the motor. On the road it's silky smoothness is deceiving, and I looked down at the GPS to see it hit 34 mph with a moderate amount of field weakening (think of it as a boost mode).

On the plus side:
1. Small size.
2. High total power and virtually infinite power adjustment.
3. Fine control over acceleration and throttle sensitivity.
4. GPS verified throttle only speed of 28 mph in standard mode, 34mph+ in boost mode.
5. Throttle is constant torque instead of constant voltage, making it easier to control.
6. Opens the door for using 48, 52, 60, and 72 volt batteries with a simple setting change.
7. Top speed with 72 volts and this controller on 20 inch wheels is 43 mph without boost.
8. It's QUIET!

There are downsides though:
1. Controller will need a heatsink to use it's full power.
2. Slight efficiency losses in boost mode.
3. Without the Cycle Analyzer display, there is no pedal assist or cruise control.
4. Even with the Cycle Analyzer display, you still have no automatic brake light.


I may have a group ride in Connecticut this weekend, and I'm fine going with my reliable 35 amp controller. But, if all the cables and parts come in, and I'm able to get it just the way I want, I may do the trip with the Phaserunner installed. The good thing is that, with all the work I put into making custom wiring harnesses, I can swap back to the other controller or even go back to stock with no damage (except my wallet!)

[Altema]

My dream e-bike just got closer: Quiet, powerful, switches between legal class 2 or 3, or can go unlimited for off roading... and it folds!

The system is installed and running with the Phaserunner V3 and Cycle Analyst V3! The only outstanding issue is the pedal assist sensor, which for some reason is not working with the original Rad sensor. I ordered another from Grin Tech, with the new one being 24 pole and enclosed.

The programming took a while, but I'm getting close to where I want it to be. Below is a marked photo of the new "cockpit". The up/down buttons control the pedal assist levels as expected. The mode switch is programmable, and I used to to change between e-bike classes. The only difference between class 1 and 2 is the throttle, so I did not bother creating a class 1 preset. Instead, the first position is class 2, middle position is class 3, and the last position is unlimited. Respective speed limits are 20mph, 28mph, and whatever you get 😉. I did this because I ride my bike in a variety of locations where laws vary, and some of it is genuinely off road.

I'm really enjoying the quietness, but a few things have cropped up now that I'm using the bike in the real world. The throttle response is instant, but off-the-line performance is not quite as strong. The reason for this is that some controllers dump full power off the line, as much as 100 amps even on a 35 amp units. The Phaserunner controls output and voltage increase times, and is therefore less aggressive for the first few feet.
Cruise control is unreliable, and when it does work, it's not like you'd expect. Instead of maintaining a specific speed, it maintains a specific power level. This is a bit useless unless you are on level ground. Go downhill and the bike speeds up, go uphill and the bike stalls. Hopefully this is a setting. Also, the overdrive is working well and I'm able to get 34mph with moderate levels of boost. I get about the same range as before, even with the feature turned on, so that's good. I absolutely love the mode switch and the power delivery, and hopefully the pedal assist will be good once that is working. I'll keep you posted!

[Altema]

I received and installed the new pedal assist sensor, and spent a day for testing and fine tuning of the overall programming. I didn't like the new PAS design. It's an enclosed unit that you push over the crank spindle, and it has no bearings. Just the plastic enclosure keeps things in line.

I went to a large park with an 8+ mile loop around the lake, and the first thing I noticed is the PAS response is instant. Too quick in my book, turning the motor on before the pedals even got the slack out of the chain. I slowed it down until it engaged just after the chain slack was taken up and freewheel engaged, and it felt very natural synchronized like that.

The auxiliary mode switch has been ideal, and I have it setup as follows. I did not bother with a "Class 1" setting because it's the same as Class 2 without a throttle.
1. Class 2, 20mph throttle/20mph pedal assist, 750 watts on PA.
2. Class 3, 20mph throttle, 28mph pedal assist, 1500 watts peak on PA.
3. Unlimited, no mph cap, 1800 watts.

The pedal assist power curve was working nicely, so I set it the same for all three modes and am happy with it.
I decided to go with 9 pedal assist levels, just because there's a huge jump between 5 levels at higher wattage levels. With the Cycle Analyst, you give the minimum and maximum power levels for assist, and it divides them up equally.
Brake cutoffs are working perfectly, but I need to figure out a way to trigger the brake light.
I have not hooked up the stock headlight and taillight because I'm not yet sure if they will handle a 52 volt battery (58.9 volts at full charge).
I found out cruise control needs to be turned on separately for all three modes, so I did that and adjust the engagement time to 5 seconds of holding the throttle.
Cruise control still locks on wattage instead of speed, and it still sucks. I'll have to contact tech support on that!


The bike is lovely to ride on both throttle and pedaling now, and I can glide silently at low power levels (below 250 watts). In class 2 mode it feels close to Rad's pretty perfect controller programming, but I can go to class 3 or unlimited when needed.

[Altema]

My PAS didn't last long. The unit I purchased has no bearings, and began to wear pretty quickly. After two days it failed. I contacted the company, they wanted to send a replacement, but I asked for another style to use with my original Rad magnet wheel.

In the meantime, I took apart the PAS unit, and found out it uses a single weak magnet, and a shutter wheel that induced changes in the magnetic field as it rotated. Not as reliable, apparently. Since I was still waiting for the replacement, I fabricated a temporary PAS from parts, and it works very well. I did need to shorten the response time because it was a 12 pole instead of a 24, but that was the only adjustment necessary. A closeup is below, with the sensor on the right and the sensor wheel on the left. The view is looking from the front wheel towards the back. I also took the liberty to seal the unit up, as the original had the legs of the sensor exposed to moisture.

[Altema]

The last basic item on the Phaserunner install was using the complete lighting system with brake lights and all, when the Phaserunner only had provision for a headlight.

Complicating matters is that the Rad taillight won't work unless it's bonded to the positive side of the brake light, which needs to be on all the time, even when the lights are off, and you can't interfere with the brake cutoff signal to the controller. The solution was to place the light switch on the positive side of the headlight and taillight, but NOT the positive of the brake light, and feed the negative side of the brake light from the lever side of the brake cutoff circuit. This circuit grounds when the brake levers are pulled, and the controller feed is is unaffected by the light when the levers are released.

I drew up the schematic first, then wired it up using spade connectors so I could make changes if needed. Happy to say it worked first time, so now I just have to cut all the temporary connectors out and wire it properly!

[Altema]

Things have been going well with the new setup. I experimented with the field weakening overdrive, got the motor up to 42mph, but I'm fine with 34mph and rolled it back to that. The torque has been fun, making the bike feel sporty, but it's a bit deceptive because of the quietness. I tried it out on the mountain bike trails, found myself at the bottom of a decent climb, and the bike took off a bit more than expected, leaving it almost out of control as it crested the top (photo of the hill is below).

I'm still working with Grin Tech on the cruise control issues. I have it working somewhat, but it is sluggish to respond to speed changes. I suspect this is because I only have one magnet on the spokes for the speedometer to read, so I'm looking to add more.

If you have any questions, please ask!

[vudude]

Wow, so all that noise is coming from the Electro Bike World 35A controller? Altema, did your RADMini PAS Sensor work with your 35A controller. I ask because assist isn't working only throttle on my 35A controller.

[Altema]

Wow, so all that noise is coming from the Electro Bike World 35A controller? Altema, did your RADMini PAS Sensor work with your 35A controller. I ask because assist isn't working only throttle on my 35A controller.

Yes, the motor sounded like an old elevator, even when I was only using 50 watts. I'm sure it was amplified by my rear rack though.

The PAS sensor did work on the 35A controller. Check your controller setting and make sure P4 is set to 0, C1 is set to 3, and C4 is set to 3. If all those are correct, then with the bike turned on and the rear wheel held off the ground (or the bike upside down), you should see the red light on the PAS sensor pulse when the pedals are turned. If you do not get the red light pulsing, then unplug the sensor and plug it back in securely, making sure the connectors line up, and the the connector seats firmly. If you still get no light, then the sensor or controller may be bad. I new sensor is not expensive, but if it does not work with the new sensor, there is probably an issue with the controller.

[polskicowboy]

I have a Rad Runner using Grin Baserunner v4 controller. I have some serious hesitation when starting and no power if rolling backwards on start/throttle. Only when my 200 pounds of weight (or a little weight) is on the seat. Did you encounter this? Both original Rad Fat (Bafang 500w?) motor and the new Bafang 1000w hub I threaded in have same issue. Grin support is at a loss to the problem. Bolton Bikes 35amp controller works fine (Electrobike sells identical). So motors are good.

Did you make your own Motor adapter cable?  Grin made me an L1019 to Z916 (Rad motor). I sent controller, cable, original motor to them to test and they said its ok.

Tried autotune on phaserunner software, default Bafang Fat settings, Pass-thru on Cycle Analyst and Bypass feature on Cycle Analyst. Not sure how to find the right cable to plug a throttle direct into controller. I have extra throttles and one from Grin (which I tested with).

Let me know if you have some helpful advice. Trying to get rear motor working so I can add a front regen motor.

Thanks

[Altema]

I have a Rad Runner using Grin Baserunner v4 controller. I have some serious hesitation when starting and no power if rolling backwards on start/throttle. Only when my 200 pounds of weight (or a little weight) is on the seat. Did you encounter this? Both original Rad Fat (Bafang 500w?) motor and the new Bafang 1000w hub I threaded in have same issue. Grin support is at a loss to the problem. Bolton Bikes 35amp controller works fine (Electrobike sells identical). So motors are good.

Did you make your own Motor adapter cable?  Grin made me an L1019 to Z916 (Rad motor). I sent controller, cable, original motor to them to test and they said its ok.

Tried autotune on phaserunner software, default Bafang Fat settings, Pass-thru on Cycle Analyst and Bypass feature on Cycle Analyst. Not sure how to find the right cable to plug a throttle direct into controller. I have extra throttles and one from Grin (which I tested with).

Let me know if you have some helpful advice. Trying to get rear motor working so I can add a front regen motor.

Thanks

I had that problem for a while. I fixed it by increasing the torque up ramp time to 200ms, and on the Advanced Setup page under "Sensorless Starting Parameters", increase your autostart injection current to almost the same as your phase current. That is, if you are using sensorless startup. Let me know if that helps, and if it doesn't, you can send me your Phaserunner configuration so I can glance at it.